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Post by veritas on Jun 15, 2018 7:18:57 GMT
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Post by jnorton45 on Jun 15, 2018 15:23:01 GMT
I don't think Fillion will work with a true female lead actor for awhile. Did he ever? Stana made herself co-star of the show in the premier (Beckett's 1st shot at the crime scene, her interrogation of Castle, reading Castle's fan mail, Castle giving her the book and her discovery of his theft, her final walk away) and then again in 1.5 and 1.6 and on and on and on for 8 seasons. Stana mentions in one of the discussions on DVD that she didn't really get a grip on Beckett until 1.7. That Fillion or anyone on his team didn't figure that out until "Still" in season 5 (episode 21?) is understandable. I'd bet that Stana and her team didn't realize the situation either until some point in season 6. Everyone was working night and day to make Castle a hit. The cast and crew were either working 14 hour days or trying to recover physically and mentally from the ordeal of making 23 episodes a year. Throw in the strong tendency of actors not to watch their own previous work especially in an on going series, because it is a major distraction from getting their immediate work done on time, and it is easy to see how it could take 4 or 5 years to catch up with the fact that the Beckett character had taken off as co-star of Castle. Fillion kept playing Castle as Fillion from premier to the last episode. Both Nathan and Castle are and were funny, attractive and charming guys and were for 8 seasons, but the same guy. Stana kept growing Beckett from episode to episode. Katic kept growing professionally with the character. It is not a wonder that there was a problem. The Rookie looks like a different show than Castle where Fillion has to play a character who appears to be very different from Castle. It's brave of him to take on a big leap like that - a challenge. Without regard to it's commercial success, The Rookie should be a good professional move for Fillion.
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Post by lurker on Jun 15, 2018 15:53:58 GMT
I've got the impression that sitcoms and most procedurals have their characters set in stone. Castle was different (and good) because you could see how the time goes by not just by the changing looks of the actors, or by the new technologies introduced, but by the background canvas of the show, and mostly by the growth of the character(s).
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quasar
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Post by quasar on Jun 17, 2018 2:28:04 GMT
Stana made herself co-star of the show in the premier (Beckett's 1st shot at the crime scene, her interrogation of Castle, reading Castle's fan mail, Castle giving her the book and her discovery of his theft, her final walk away) and then again in 1.5 and 1.6 and on and on and on for 8 seasons. Stana mentions in one of the discussions on DVD that she didn't really get a grip on Beckett until 1.7. That Fillion or anyone on his team didn't figure that out until "Still" in season 5 (episode 21?) is understandable. I'd bet that Stana and her team didn't realize the situation either until some point in season 6. Everyone was working night and day to make Castle a hit. The cast and crew were either working 14 hour days or trying to recover physically and mentally from the ordeal of making 23 episodes a year. Throw in the strong tendency of actors not to watch their own previous work especially in an on going series, because it is a major distraction from getting their immediate work done on time, and it is easy to see how it could take 4 or 5 years to catch up with the fact that the Beckett character had taken off as co-star of Castle. Fillion kept playing Castle as Fillion from premier to the last episode. Both Nathan and Castle are and were funny, attractive and charming guys and were for 8 seasons, but the same guy. Stana kept growing Beckett from episode to episode. Katic kept growing professionally with the character. It is not a wonder that there was a problem. The Rookie looks like a different show than Castle where Fillion has to play a character who appears to be very different from Castle. It's brave of him to take on a big leap like that - a challenge. Without regard to it's commercial success, The Rookie should be a good professional move for Fillion. I was with you for the first two paragraphs, but disagree with the next two. IMO Rick did start growing up and maturing in the early seasons, even to the point of how he reacted to the crimes, victims, and the justice in seeking the perps, and Nathan did a good job of showing that while keeping the core of Rick fairly lighthearted. Things went off track for me in his portrayal in season 6, when too often he played the character as lackluster about life in general and the love of his life. S7 was more of the same and S8 was terrible unless the focus was on the throwback of his character to the very early seasons. Nathan only seemed to come to play if Rick were really playing the 12 year-old on a sugar rush. As for The Rookie, it's too early to judge but from what I've read and seen his role is more caricature than character. ll of the characters seem like that to me. Here's the older white male struggling to keep up with guys half his age. Here's the Asian female rookie struggling against prejudice. Here's the older woman struggling with a position of authority. And so on. TV procedurals have been there, done that for decades now. I don't see the characters going anywhere. If the show makes it, I'll be surprised. That's more about the setup of the show than about Nathan. It's just a tired formula.
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Post by latte on Jun 17, 2018 3:58:14 GMT
Stana made herself co-star of the show in the premier (Beckett's 1st shot at the crime scene, her interrogation of Castle, reading Castle's fan mail, Castle giving her the book and her discovery of his theft, her final walk away) and then again in 1.5 and 1.6 and on and on and on for 8 seasons. Stana mentions in one of the discussions on DVD that she didn't really get a grip on Beckett until 1.7. That Fillion or anyone on his team didn't figure that out until "Still" in season 5 (episode 21?) is understandable. I'd bet that Stana and her team didn't realize the situation either until some point in season 6. Everyone was working night and day to make Castle a hit. The cast and crew were either working 14 hour days or trying to recover physically and mentally from the ordeal of making 23 episodes a year. Throw in the strong tendency of actors not to watch their own previous work especially in an on going series, because it is a major distraction from getting their immediate work done on time, and it is easy to see how it could take 4 or 5 years to catch up with the fact that the Beckett character had taken off as co-star of Castle. Fillion kept playing Castle as Fillion from premier to the last episode. Both Nathan and Castle are and were funny, attractive and charming guys and were for 8 seasons, but the same guy. Stana kept growing Beckett from episode to episode. Katic kept growing professionally with the character. It is not a wonder that there was a problem. The Rookie looks like a different show than Castle where Fillion has to play a character who appears to be very different from Castle. It's brave of him to take on a big leap like that - a challenge. Without regard to it's commercial success, The Rookie should be a good professional move for Fillion. I was with you for the first two paragraphs, but disagree with the next two. IMO Rick did start growing up and maturing in the early seasons, even to the point of how he reacted to the crimes, victims, and the justice in seeking the perps, and Nathan did a good job of showing that while keeping the core of Rick fairly lighthearted. Things went off track for me in his portrayal in season 6, when too often he played the character as lackluster about life in general and the love of his life. S7 was more of the same and S8 was terrible unless the focus was on the throwback of his character to the very early seasons. Nathan only seemed to come to play if Rick were really playing the 12 year-old on a sugar rush. As for The Rookie, it's too early to judge but from what I've read and seen his role is more caricature than character. ll of the characters seem like that to me. Here's the older white male struggling to keep up with guys half his age. Here's the Asian female rookie struggling against prejudice. Here's the older woman struggling with a position of authority. And so on. TV procedurals have been there, done that for decades now. I don't see the characters going anywhere. If the show makes it, I'll be surprised. That's more about the setup of the show than about Nathan. It's just a tired formula.
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Post by sydauscaskettfan2412 on Jun 17, 2018 13:51:13 GMT
Stana made herself co-star of the show in the premier (Beckett's 1st shot at the crime scene, her interrogation of Castle, reading Castle's fan mail, Castle giving her the book and her discovery of his theft, her final walk away) and then again in 1.5 and 1.6 and on and on and on for 8 seasons. Stana mentions in one of the discussions on DVD that she didn't really get a grip on Beckett until 1.7. That Fillion or anyone on his team didn't figure that out until "Still" in season 5 (episode 21?) is understandable. I'd bet that Stana and her team didn't realize the situation either until some point in season 6. Everyone was working night and day to make Castle a hit. The cast and crew were either working 14 hour days or trying to recover physically and mentally from the ordeal of making 23 episodes a year. Throw in the strong tendency of actors not to watch their own previous work especially in an on going series, because it is a major distraction from getting their immediate work done on time, and it is easy to see how it could take 4 or 5 years to catch up with the fact that the Beckett character had taken off as co-star of Castle. Fillion kept playing Castle as Fillion from premier to the last episode. Both Nathan and Castle are and were funny, attractive and charming guys and were for 8 seasons, but the same guy. Stana kept growing Beckett from episode to episode. Katic kept growing professionally with the character. It is not a wonder that there was a problem. The Rookie looks like a different show than Castle where Fillion has to play a character who appears to be very different from Castle. It's brave of him to take on a big leap like that - a challenge. Without regard to it's commercial success, The Rookie should be a good professional move for Fillion. I agree with paragraphs 1-3, and especially 3. It willl be interesting how the female costar gets on in her profession.
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KB1L40
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Post by KB1L40 on Jun 19, 2018 13:45:26 GMT
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Post by jnorton45 on Jun 19, 2018 15:57:48 GMT
We haven't heard much about the content of The Rookie and we shouldn't expect to until late August or early September. Still it would be interesting. As the tvline article states that Fillion is a known quantity with ABC viewers. That known quantity is very heavy on the comic. From what little I've see so far The Rookie doesn't have much comedy. It could with a Law and Order style of cop humor. We'll see. What we've seen so far in the trailer and promo is a melodramatic tone lacking in humor. If ABC viewers are expecting Castle style humor, it appears that they will be disappointed.
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Post by crosscastle on Jun 19, 2018 20:02:10 GMT
I do not know ,every time I see NF I see Rick Castle then I wonder when will Beckett come into view.??? It is really hard.
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KB1L40
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Post by KB1L40 on Jun 20, 2018 8:49:57 GMT
JNorton - thanks for that info. So are you saying that you don't think it will make the fall schedule but begin sometime mid 2019?
Crosscastle - I don't have your problem with Nathan because I've not watched him in anything other than Castle but I wonder how many Castle fans will have your reaction when they watch The Rookie...
B :-)
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Post by prd4castle on Jun 20, 2018 14:56:59 GMT
I do not know ,every time I see NF I see Rick Castle then I wonder when will Beckett come into view.??? It is really hard. I got the same exact feeling when I saw SK in Absentia. I think they both would be wise to pick characters that are far removed from Castle. I didn't look for Beckett when NF appeared in various sitcoms, and I didn't look for Castle when SK was in Sisters. But I will give The Rookie a chance.
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Post by kbex on Jun 20, 2018 19:01:33 GMT
I do not know ,every time I see NF I see Rick Castle then I wonder when will Beckett come into view.??? It is really hard. I got the same exact feeling when I saw SK in Absentia. I think they both would be wise to pick characters that are far removed from Castle. I didn't look for Beckett when NF appeared in various sitcoms, and I didn't look for Castle when SK was in Sisters. But I will give The Rookie a chance. I never once looked for NF in Absentia. Absentia is not a dramedy and it’s not a show Castle the character would ever appear in or fit into, in my opinion. However, The Rookie is a light drama police procedural that the character of Beckett would fit perfectly into.
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quasar
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Post by quasar on Jun 20, 2018 20:26:52 GMT
I do not know ,every time I see NF I see Rick Castle then I wonder when will Beckett come into view.??? It is really hard. I got the same exact feeling when I saw SK in Absentia. I think they both would be wise to pick characters that are far removed from Castle. I didn't look for Beckett when NF appeared in various sitcoms, and I didn't look for Castle when SK was in Sisters. But I will give The Rookie a chance. For me Absentia was so far removed from Castle the show and Emily from Kate, that I never gave the show, Kate or Rick a thought while watching it. And I certainly never wondered about Nathan. Stana was Emily from the first moment on. Lately, while recuperating from shoulder surgery, I've been watching a lot of procedurals on Acorn, binging on one right after another. It amazes me how alike the set-ups are and yet the shows with well-written characters and good actors make each one stand on their own. Who said there were only 20 plots in all of literature? More recently some author claimed there are only seven. So we may be stuck watching similar plots again and again, but it's the characters, dialogue, humor, drama, etc that get and keep me interested.
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quasar
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Post by quasar on Jun 22, 2018 19:07:59 GMT
There was a promo for The Rookie during the premiere of Take Two last night. I just don't get it. Once again there wasn't anything interesting or different about the 30-second spot. Nothing new to capture your attention and say, hey, you gotta watch this. Not even a bit of acting or dialogue. The whole thing seemed decades old.
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Post by castlegramma on Jun 22, 2018 23:37:08 GMT
There was a promo for The Rookie during the premiere of Take Two last night. I just don't get it. Once again there wasn't anything interesting or different about the 30-second spot. Nothing new to capture your attention and say, hey, you gotta watch this. Not even a bit of acting or dialogue. The whole thing seemed decades old. I must agree. I commented in the Take Two section that it just irritated me to see that commercial, especially during this show. Do they think it will encourage burned Castle fans to watch?! Those who enjoy NF will be following his career anyway and don't need a commercial during Milmar's show to remind them.
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Post by prd4castle on Jun 23, 2018 0:29:21 GMT
ABCspent a lot of time advertising Take Two as being from the creators of Castle, therefore it makes sense that they would advertise The Rookie on Take Two. It is the package of viewers they are trying to appeal to.
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quasar
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Post by quasar on Jun 23, 2018 2:06:25 GMT
It didn't irritate me to see The Rookie promo during Take Two and I agree it makes sense to go after the Take Two audience. My issue is with its content. If that's all they've got for trailers and promos (and I think I've seen all that are out there), it doesn't say much for the show, the characters, actors, etc. Each one has been boringly familiar and so far all I've seen from Nathan is the worse of his acting. It's pitiful.
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Post by castlefan1212 on Jun 23, 2018 6:07:36 GMT
Once again the topic is filled with bashing. I don’t get it. I thought this thread was supposed to be safe from the haters and for positivity. But nope. Every single post is just bashing. And the mods don’t do anything to make it safe and welcoming!
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Post by jnorton45 on Jun 23, 2018 13:54:59 GMT
Once again the topic is filled with bashing. I don’t get it. I thought this thread was supposed to be safe from the haters and for positivity. But nope. Every single post is just bashing. And the mods don’t do anything to make it safe and welcoming! Criticism of an artistic undertaking comes with the territory. Mature artists relish well explained criticism. You can say that you don't like something, but it means nothing if you don't give some significant detail as to why. At which point the artist can reject the criticism, confront it or take it under advisement. I think the big criticism of The Rookie here has been "Is that all you got?" The Rookie is going to be the lead show for ABC on Tuesdays this fall. That is about as set in stone as things get in TV. ABC apparently one a bidding war for this show. The script shouldn't be that difficult because it is based on a true story. When it doubt write what happened. I'd bet the person whose true story it is got a large chunk of change and a piece of the backend. They are making The Rookie in the US. Bottom line The Rookie has a large amount of money tied up with the potential to make buckets more. The show is officially a very big deal. For the first network promo of The Rookie that you would see something much better than the promo from what we can only hope were early days on the set. Those early promos are not nearly up to the standard for shows that have money, the backing and the exposure The Rookie has. But, what did we get those terrible first cut promos. That does not look good. Promos are supposed to be the best clips of the best stuff you have. If what the production company and ABC think is the best stuff from The Rookie so far, I'd be concerned. Progress was expected and didn't happen.
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Post by castlefan1212 on Jun 23, 2018 14:05:22 GMT
Once again the topic is filled with bashing. I don’t get it. I thought this thread was supposed to be safe from the haters and for positivity. But nope. Every single post is just bashing. And the mods don’t do anything to make it safe and welcoming! Criticism of an artistic undertaking comes with the territory. Mature artists relish well explained criticism. You can say that you don't like something, but it means nothing if you don't give some significant detail as to why. At which point the artist can reject the criticism, confront it or take it under advisement. I think the big criticism of The Rookie here has been "Is that all you got?" The Rookie is going to be the lead show for ABC on Tuesdays this fall. That is about as set in stone as things get in TV. ABC apparently one a bidding war for this show. The script shouldn't be that difficult because it is based on a true story. When it doubt write what happened. I'd bet the person whose true story it is got a large chunk of change and a piece of the backend. They are making The Rookie in the US. Bottom line The Rookie has a large amount of money tied up with the potential to make buckets more. The show is officially a very big deal. For the first network promo of The Rookie that you would see something much better than the promo from what we can only hope were early days on the set. Those early promos are not nearly up to the standard for shows that have money, the backing and the exposure The Rookie has. But, what did we get those terrible first cut promos. That does not look good. Promos are supposed to be the best clips of the best stuff you have. If what the production company and ABC think is the best stuff from The Rookie so far, I'd be concerned. Progress was expected and didn't happen. I was not referencing to you. Majority of the times, I like your posts and your reasonings. I guess I got pissed at the comment which complained about the Rookie promo airing during Take Two where someone was trying to make it into some conspiracy theory. Every other show gets promoted during commercial breaks. It’s not just The Rookie. It’s obvious to me that most people on this board don’t critique The Rookie objectively. It comes from a very heavy bias which I think is unfair. Not talking about you as you seem to have a balanced view point or at least try to not hurt the feelings of others who may be reading this board as well.
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Post by jnorton45 on Jun 23, 2018 18:32:52 GMT
Criticism of an artistic undertaking comes with the territory. Mature artists relish well explained criticism. You can say that you don't like something, but it means nothing if you don't give some significant detail as to why. At which point the artist can reject the criticism, confront it or take it under advisement. I think the big criticism of The Rookie here has been "Is that all you got?" The Rookie is going to be the lead show for ABC on Tuesdays this fall. That is about as set in stone as things get in TV. ABC apparently one a bidding war for this show. The script shouldn't be that difficult because it is based on a true story. When it doubt write what happened. I'd bet the person whose true story it is got a large chunk of change and a piece of the backend. They are making The Rookie in the US. Bottom line The Rookie has a large amount of money tied up with the potential to make buckets more. The show is officially a very big deal. For the first network promo of The Rookie that you would see something much better than the promo from what we can only hope were early days on the set. Those early promos are not nearly up to the standard for shows that have money, the backing and the exposure The Rookie has. But, what did we get those terrible first cut promos. That does not look good. Promos are supposed to be the best clips of the best stuff you have. If what the production company and ABC think is the best stuff from The Rookie so far, I'd be concerned. Progress was expected and didn't happen. I was not referencing to you. Majority of the times, I like your posts and your reasonings. I guess I got pissed at the comment which complained about the Rookie promo airing during Take Two where someone was trying to make it into some conspiracy theory. Every other show gets promoted during commercial breaks. It’s not just The Rookie. It’s obvious to me that most people on this board don’t critique The Rookie objectively. It comes from a very heavy bias which I think is unfair. Not talking about you as you seem to have a balanced view point or at least try to not hurt the feelings of others who may be reading this board as well. Not an issue to be concerned about, because some folks do post stuff that is negative and not critical which doesn't give anyone a clue about what it is that is bothering anyone. And, it is good to point out what you think is unfair. Keep it up and expand on what you see as unfair so we all can understand and probably comment. It's part of the process and fun. Now to a point of criticism on what I've seen in the promo material for The Rookie. I was watching the directors and screen writer's commentary for the film A Good Year - Ridley Scott and Mack Klein - when they made a comment about the performance of Russell Crowe. (DVD's of Scott's films usually have a highly insightful commentary on the film. It's like going to grad school.) What makes Crow so good is that when emotions of the situation in the scene are running high, he underplayed them to heighten the impact of the emotion by reducing the impact of the performance and the actor. Interesting and true. In what we've seen to date, hardly anything to have an opinion about at all, scenes of emotion have overplayed making the performance about the actor and not the emotion of the piece. Another way of putting it is you don't see the emotion of the situation. You see the actor acting. Given that The Rookie is supposed to be part of the A team for ABC. I would have expected to see them bring their A game.
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quasar
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Post by quasar on Jun 23, 2018 21:23:31 GMT
Good stuff, jnorton.
castlefan1212, I too hope you continue to post your views, but it would help to know what you specifically think is bashing and hate. I've seen very little of that on this thread. As star and one of the producers, Nathan is bound to be mentioned and possibly held accountable for negative opinions about the series. As for my comments about The Rookie, I believe most have focused on my reaction to the released information and videos with the caveat that it's early days yet to judge.
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Post by NYerBornnbred on Jun 24, 2018 0:32:48 GMT
It seems to me that there could be some confusion about this thread. Unlike in the Stana thread and the Sundae thread, there shouldn't be any expectation that posts will necessarily be positive; this is a thread to talk about any and all opinions about the show, positive or negative, subject only to the restriction of no spoilers (and, of course, no personal attacks on other posters). If you want to see how that works out, just take a look at the Absentia threads - they are full of negative comments about the show, many of them by me (I still think it was pretty bad, and as a big fan of SK I only hope that it's a lot better in season 2). People have every right to express whatever opinions they want to here, and other people should understand that.
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Post by jnorton45 on Jun 24, 2018 4:27:22 GMT
Considering the old days of Castle posts on open sites. Nobody is doing anything I take as bashing.
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KB1L40
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Post by KB1L40 on Jun 25, 2018 13:43:20 GMT
JNorton - Ahh, those good ol' days on the ABC Boards! At times, armor was required, or a a tumbler of your favorite drink...
B :-)
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Post by jnorton45 on Jun 29, 2018 17:26:31 GMT
ABC needs to get much better ad spots for The Rookie. It looks less and less interesting.
The second and more substantial problem is that the Castle fan base that will tune in The Rookie is looking for lots of comedy from Nathan. The Rookie looks like drama, maybe melodrama. Castle fans will be disappointed. That's not really fair to Fillion who is taking a risk going counter to expectations, but fan expectations are important.
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KB1L40
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Post by KB1L40 on Jul 2, 2018 14:57:08 GMT
JNorton - I think Castle fans will tune in out of curiosity. I personally think that Nathan can deliver serious if well written. I immediately think of the 4yrs waiting speech, or his reaction to the kidnapping of first Alexis and then Kate.
Not sure if I was reading the reaction on twitter (for which I don't have an account) or another board with comments posted about the Rookie but I again personally found it a little sad that Nathan's fans kept referring to their Captain or The Captain. To me they have put him firmly in the box marked Firefly and no mention of any other projects that he has done as if they are not interested in Nathan being anything other than Captain Mal.
B :-)
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Post by lurker on Jul 4, 2018 14:28:04 GMT
JNorton - Ahh, those good ol' days on the ABC Boards! At times, armor was required, or a a tumbler of your favorite drink... B :-) Ahh, it would have been even better if ABC didn't shut the forum before season 8 (I think), before shit hit the fan (sorry for my vocabulary). Just remembered that the explanation was that "fans can exchange their thoughts and opinions, and discuss the show on Castle twitter account." Worst explanation ever, almost on the level of "budget cuts."
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Post by sydauscaskettfan2412 on Jul 4, 2018 14:36:42 GMT
JNorton - Ahh, those good ol' days on the ABC Boards! At times, armor was required, or a a tumbler of your favorite drink... B :-) Ahh, it would have been even better if ABC didn't shut the forum before season 8 (I think), before shit hit the fan (sorry for my vocabulary). Just remembered that the explanation was that "fans can exchange their thoughts and opinions, and discuss the show on Castle twitter account." Worst explanation ever, almost on the level of "budget cuts." Agree as I was a member at the time it shut down, but also made new friends when I joined familyinfo board started by "Sir", and some friends from abc were already also at familyinfo. But I do remember the comment re that the fans could join or follow twitter re the show......totally agree re 'worst explanaton ever, almost on the level of "budget cuts". The abc board mod, stevo47 shut the board down virtually soon after Hollanders Woods.
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Post by crosscastle on Jul 11, 2018 15:32:17 GMT
None of us want Nathan Fillion to do bad acting. We all hope for the best. I am making a wide generality .
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